Search Results: "ana"

15 March 2007

Ben Hutchings: Developing a DV mixer

For this year's DebConf, we (the video team) want to be able to use multiple cameras like at DebConf 5, where we had one for the projection screen and one for the presenter fed to an analogue mixer and a digitiser. At DC6 we had no mixer and no budget for one. Same at DC7 - unless we can do it with software. Toresbe had a go at writing one but didn't finish. I want to give it a go. So:

14 March 2007

Clint Adams: Beat your maintainers with a whisk, not a whip

Marco is remembering a time long ago, before people threw away their dictionaries so they wouldn't be able to look up what policy means, and before they started foaming at the mouth and mindlessly spouting metaphors with the word stick in them.

Yves-Alexis Perez: Debian and crypto-containers

Theses days, I've been looking for a way to have crypto-containers in Debian. I wanted something easy to use, easy to move but still quite secure, which wouldn't require root access to the box, and as an option could use my gpg key.

I looked closely at two projects:

* cryptsetup/luks

The nice thing is that you only have one file containing all your crypted filesystem, it uses the Linux unified key management system (luks), and you are able to use a gpg key to crypt the data. I didn't tried it yet, because there are some drawbacks which I find really important. It uses multiple commands for every operations (creating the container, mounting and unmounting it).

For creating the crypto container you need to:
- create the file
- use it as a loop device (root access)
- initialize the container
- open the container
- create a filesystem on it
- mount it

Each time you want to mount it, you need to:
- create the loop device from the file
- open the container
- mount it

It surely can be wrapped, but that may be difficult to deploy. And you need root access for all operations (you can mount/umount without it using fstab, pmount or things like that, but still it's using privilegied access). And the major drawback, I think, is that the container size is fixed. You choose it when you create the initial file which you'll mount as a loop device. I don't know if there's a way to extend it after creating crypto-container, but anyway it'll need to be manual.

* encfs

encfs is fuse-based, so it doesn't require anything, beside fuse support in the kernel and your user belonging to fuse group. No need to root access nor anything. You create the container with only one command, then mount or umount it with only one command too. You can add and remove files from the container without asking yourself about disk usage or something, because the container is "expanded" (see after) when you add files, automatically.

There are two drawbacks in encfs, for me:
- crypto-container isn't a file, but a folder, with files and folders using crypted filenames but real size. (more or less, because you can use options to modify it but you won't hide a 20MB file for example). It's less secure than a one-file crypto-container where you can't determine how many files there are in it (and with crypsetup/luks, you won't be able to determine how much space is used in the container as the size is fixed anyway). It's less easy to move around, put on an usb key or transmit. You can tar it, yes, but you lose the comfort.
- you can't use a gpg key

In the end, I guess I'd like something like .dmg OSX Disk Images, which can be encrypted. They are really easy to use, as far as I could have seen. Maybe not so secure, but this is a bruteforce attack against master password (1024 bits RSA key), not against 128bits aes key of the container.

Anyway, I've setup an encfs folder here, but am still looking for something wich would improve the situation.

Norbert Tretkowski: Switched to GNOME

After the discussion about the upcoming non-free license change of the ion3 window manager, I decided to take a closer look at GNOME again. Last week I installed GNOME 2.14 from etch on my laptop, upgraded to 2.16 (which was a pain at that time), and found that I could actually make use of it. Meanwhile I also use GNOME 2.16 on my workstations at work and at home.

Martin Michlmayr: GCC

The GNU Compiler Collection (GCC) is a compiler suite which supports a number of programming languages, such as C and C++. It is a very important development tool and is the standard compiler among free software projects. GCC was quite stagnant in the middle of the 1990s until the EGCS project formed. EGCS took over development of the official GCC in October 1998 and instituted rigorous processes, such as high levels of peer review, and created a steering committee which has the power to appoint maintainers and make important decisions. In theory, the project follows a time based release with an interval of six months. In practice, the project has released only one new version every year in recent times.
VersionDateMonths
3.02001-06-18
3.12002-05-1511
3.22002-08-143
3.32003-05-139
3.4.02004-04-1811
4.0.02005-04-2012
4.1.02006-02-2810
Past problems Solutions Outstanding problems

Nacho Barrientos Arias: Debian developer

Yes, that’s it, I’m finally Debian developer. I would like to use this post to say thanks to everyone who helped me to achieve this goal since I applied in 2005-10-05, here we go! Thanks to… I hope to write an small report about the NM process with my impressions and opinions soon, so stay tuned. By the way, if you are planning to join Debian and you’re able to meet me, I’m offering GPG key signing since today :) Finally, thanks to all my #dudes!

Russell Coker: getting big changes in Debian

Erich Schubert comments on the issues relating to getting big changes into Debian. This is something that I had also noticed. I started work on SE Linux in Debian in 2001 and continued it actively until 2003 when I joined Red Hat. Less than a year after I joined Red Hat there was a Fedora release with SE Linux fully integrated and shortly after that there was a release with SE Linux on by default. The reason for this was that Red Hat management supported the idea of SE Linux and everyone had to accept it. There was no option for a package maintainer to refuse to support SE Linux.

Recently in a discussion on debian-devel one DD (who I won't name in this blog post) advocated removing SE Linux support from dpkg. I then asked him whether he had the same attitude towards non-executable stack
(Exec-Shield/PaX/OpenWall), Poly-Instantiated directories, and PIE executables. When he expressed interest in having those features I pointed out that one of the enemies of security in Debian is the fact that every person controls their little area and has no requirement to work towards common goals (apart from the most obvious ones of making the system work).

This means that instead of having a little cooperation from other developers anyone who wants to get a significant change included will have to fight hundreds of battles.

SE Linux is a classic example of this. Debian could have had SE Linux support long before Fedora, but instead it gets it long afterwards.

The same battles occur with regard to all the other security measures I mentioned (and some others I didn't). We could made Debian the most secure Linux distribution, there are many people who have the skills and the interest in doing so.

If you want features such as exec-shield, then you are missing out - largely because the people with the skill and time to work on them are too busy fighting trench-warfare rather than actively coding.

Now while I strongly object to most incarnations of the "you can't force a volunteer to do anything" meme that infects Debian I do agree that we can't force developers to write new code. We can however strongly discourate an antagonistic attitude towards new features. If someone proposes a feature
that you don't plan to use but which doesn't hurt you then there's no reason to attack - you can just ignore it. If someone sends in a patch that adds a feature which is requested by many people but you personally don't use, then if it has little or no down-side (linking against a couple of shared objects as is the case for many SE Linux enabled programs provides no measurable overhead) and the code is good it should be merged!

The real problem is that some DDs are more concerned about what is best for them personally (in the most short-term manner) than about what is best for the users.

Martin Michlmayr: Debian

The aim of Debian is to integrate software produced by other projects to create a complete operating system based on free software. In recent years, the project has faced increasingly delayed and unpredictable releases. Most notably, the release process of Debian 3.1 was characterized by major delays. Initially announced for December 1, 2003, the software was finally released in June 2005: a delay of one and a half years. Since then, the project has made a number of improvements to its release process.
VersionDateMonths
1.11996-06-17
1.21996-12-126
1.31997-06-026
2.01998-07-2414
2.11999-03-097
2.22000-08-1417
3.02002-07-1923
3.12005-06-0635
Past Problems Solutions Outstanding problems

Jonathan McDowell: In search of X

A while back I decided that I needed my CD collection needed something for every letter. I've managed them all except X. Anyone any suggestions? My last.fm profile should hopefully give an idea of what I like.

Gunnar Wolf: High, cold, tiring, beautiful, delightful, proud... Should I go on?

[ Warning: Long post follows ]
Just today, I read that H01ger is happy he can wear just a T-shirt somewhere in Northern Germany. Well, from my point of view, much the opposite has happened. And I'm not just happy - I'm fucking proud!
About four years ago, Nadezhda went almost every weekend to hike to the mountains with the Grupo de los Cien people. I'll sidetrack a bit to speak about them: Grupo de los Cien is a group of mountain lovers (no relation with the enviromentalist group which later took the same name) that, since the 1950s, have built and maintained the high mountain shelters in Central Mexico. It is a group, by the way, with which Nadezhda fell completely in love - and now it's up to me to find out why ;-) But lets go back to the main topic.
Almost every week, she came back delighted and loaded of energy from a mountain hike. Almost every week, I told her I wished to go with her, of course, if they went to a simpler route. Of course, lugging around over 130Kg of humanity is no easy deal. And, after over a year and because of many problems that came together at once, she stopped going to the mountain as well. She always kept an eye on their friends, but so far had not been able to return to the mountain.

Ok, so last week she heard the group was organizing volunteers to go fix the Ayoloco 2 shelter. She signed up, and invited me. I was afraid, but accepted the challenge - Of course, full of fear.
Being this a historical event (at least in my life), I cannot but offer you some of the photos I took. And, yes, I've just started playing with Flickr. Lets see if it works for me ;-)
Saturday, 5 AM, we woke up. 5:50AM, we met part of the group near Daniel's house, in Condesa. 7 AM, we were having a nice breakfast (tamales and coffee, yum!) in Amecameca, still 28km from La Joya. From Amecameca, we went to Paso de Cort s, where we met the rest of the group, and from there we went by a little, bumpy and unpaved road until La Joya. Somewhat around 20 people started the hike at around 9 AM.


According to Google Earth, La Joya (just South of the Iztacc huatl - white woman or sleeping woman in N huatl) is at 3995m - And, of course, to start at that altitude is not easy. The air is very thin, and walking a little bit too fast quickly makes you feel the blood pumping, trying to get some more oxygen. I often remembered how my Bolivian friends behave in Potos , walking slowly even when in a hurry :)

We first went down a little valley, then up. The first portion of the hike was on soft, wet sand, with some grass (what we call zacate - Strong, hard grass, not what you commonly see in a garden). I soon learnt that was a blessing, as it was by far the easiest part. Then we went up a steep and quite rocky area - It started getting tricky for somebody not used to trusting his own feet. And it was steep, yes. This was the first time (of many, of course) I started thinking whether I should head back.

We reached what I foolishly thought was the summit, only to find a steeper, longer way to go. It started getting common to find little deposits of snow/ice (I don't know the exact term in English - it's called aguanieve in Spanish, literally snow-water. [[Update]: Thanks to the now-DD H01ger, I now know that aguanieve in English is called sleet]. I understand it's a bit harder than snow, but still much lighter than hail). We crossed a completely rocky section - No sand to hold the rocks to their place. That meant being extra careful (and thus, extra slow).

But just afterwards, in case it was not enough, Mother Nature answered my pleads for some sand - we crossed a section made exclusively of loose sand. And, please, if you have ever walked upwards on sand, imagine doing so at over 4000 meters. I was taking so much care of how and where I stepped that I strayed not more than 5 meters down of the path the group was following - Being able to climb back to the right path was really not easy. This was the point that not only I was thinking about heading back, but I'm sure Nadezhda thought I would abort the mission. She cheered me up, took some pictures of me as soon as I got out of the sand trap, and we were able to move on.

After the sand, some more rocks, and we started feeling the chilly wind. We entered a cloudy region - Humidity does get the coldness into your bones! We could not really see where was the rest of the group, so we proceeded the best way we could. Fortunately for Nadezhda and me, just behind us came the very experienced Mario Corsalini and led us. And, yes, we finally saw the Ayoloco 2 shelter.

I was by then exhausted, after some four hours of ascent. I ate one of my apples - The sweetest apple I have tasted so far. After resting a bit, and realizing I was almost frozen (we were at 2 Celsius under, with constant chilly, humid wind)... Then I started working with the guys, reinforcing the shelter, while Nadezhda and some other people painted the inside with. People started eating - of course, I joined them. And, after some time up there, we started going back down. Miguel ngel, a volunteer in the Izta-Popo park, walked a good portion of the descent with me, giving me tons of help and tips. Thank you, thank you, really. The descent is, of course, much easier - We were chatting most of the time, and we made only around two hours back. The weather was quite nice on us - We had some aguanieve falling every now and then (yes! Yes! many of you guys have heard/read me bitch on how I had never seen snow falling before - Ok, this is not exactly snow, but I think it qualifies as my first experience ;-) ), but aguanieve does not make you wet, as it bounces off the clothes. When we approached La Joya we started having some light rain. We hopped in the cars, and then the rain really began.
But even if this was not enough: Grupo de los Cien was celebrating the 83th birthday of one of its senior members, Poncho Rico. No, being 83 years old is not an excuse for skipping this memorable hike.

We went to Anatolio's house, very close to Amecameca, and had a delicious dinner, cake and drinks.
Nadezhda: Thank you. So, so, so very much. Thank you for being so patient with me, for dragging me up the Sleeping Woman. Thank you for getting me into this so very important and beautiful experience. I hope this will be the first of many. There is still a very long way for me to go before I'm really up to the challenge, but believe me: This will not be my last time on the mighty mountains.

Eddy Petrișor: Wishlist for lenny... or why debian packaging is considered hard

(Update: Yes, Gunnar, the policy says that the debian/rules file must be a makefile, so if you do something else, you have a serious bug because of a policy break. Of course, probably there is nothing that should stop one from using, let's say bash, or python or perl, from a technical PoV.)

Erich has a wish list for Lenny.

What draw my attention was the very first "define and deploy a standard way of packaging software, that can be used for like 90% of packages", later he mentions rationale "other distributions (e.g. *BSD ports, Gentoo?) are ahead of us in this respect, having a standard way of packaging and building things and keeping track of changes."; these two quotes contain the real essence of Gentoo's success in the area of fast development.

A half a year ago I did an experiment in packaging a rpm, a deb and an ebuild for the same piece of software. What I observed back then made me think a lot about the entry level knowledge needed for a person to create a decent package for those types of package systems.

With the risk of being flamed by many people that will miss my point, I will tell you from the start that the deb would have been the most painful if had to start from scratch. Second would have been the rpm due to lack of good/updated documentation and the clear winner in lack of pain points was the ebuild. In reality places were switched between the deb and the rpm.

And before I start, please understand that what I want to point out is that the building system in debian is showing its age and we should do something about it, and is not about pointing people to documentation; it is about making things behave more sanely by default and not about having to read a whole day to understand why the package fails to install a file you just added then to find that you had to add the destination path to a debian/dirs file etc...


The deb had to be the most difficult. Not because I didn't do it before, or because it was hard, but because there are a lot of things that need to be done because the package management is not smart enough to do it by default (i.e. class inheritance does not exist, like is the case for the ebuilds or the macros for rpms).

The Debian approach is backwards, is reversed with regard to the others and the way it should be by default, to allow easier understanding of the packaging. You can, by default, make a package that is tweaked a lot. There is no concept (if you don't count cdbs which is boo-ed a lot by some people) or possibility to just say "make this package a package that is a standard linux app with the regular ./configure && make && make install recipe". And I don't count such a recipe the templates based on dh_make, that is way too verbose. A new maintainer wannabe has difficulties understanding why are those lines in there, and what they do, and most importantly, why is that order correct and no other. Another question which is legitimate is "is that the minimum or can that be trimmed"? (Follow debian-mentors and see how many people leave the .ex files just because they are afraid they will not know how to generate them again.)

Even the rpm has a concept of standard stuff to do for a package, there are some macros that implement that. And that is more logical for an untainted mind (as in not yet debianized) than what we have in the dh_make template, or worse, a clean and new debian/rules file. Why should one care to learn the ways and philosophy of make just to make a small package?


Let me tell you something that will feel like knife stab for many people in our community: the clear winner was the ebuild, not because I was smart or exciting, but because:

I did the ebuild in one day's work (it was less, but some will not believe me, so I'd say 1 day is reasonable enough) starting from absolutely 0 knowledge about the packaging system (if you don't count knowing to emerge package as knowledge).

What is done properly in the portage system is the fact that there are some default classes which your ebuild can inherit to behave more like a certain type of packages (base - a generic recipe, gnome, kde, games, sourceforge - they download tarballs directly, if needed - ...)

Why this is not possible for deb right now? Simple, we have it as a rule in the policy that the debian/rules file is a makefile. So even if one would implement a class-like model for deb packages, you'd still have the debian/rules file as a make file...

Gentoo implemented initially portage's default behaviour (and as a consequence, the "classes") in shell, later they migrated some parts to python and the whole portage is implemented in python now (while classes are implemented in bash). I am not saying that we should put python in essential, God forbid, probably the emdebian guys would stab me :-), I am saying that possibilities exist, alternatives should be possible.

I know, some will just say "show me the code", "making such a change over the entire archive is insane" or "the makefile is a really good way to do things like installing and building, after all, that's what it was designed for". Yes, all of these will miss the point, which is having nothing-to-do as a default policy for a package is a bad policy, it should be an empty/default package will use a standard recipe to build itself, and that recipe should be implemented in the build system.


And if you still don't believe me, just look at these few ebuilds and tell me you'd not be able to write them after a quarter after seeing one the first time and skimming over the docs or/and knowing what a regular gentoo user knows (what a keyword is, what is a slot). Also compare with the debian counter parts and don't forget the different building aids that we have.

http://sources.gentoo.org/viewcvs.py/gentoo-x86/games-arcade/amphetamine/amphetamine-0.8.10.ebuild?view=markup
http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/pkg-games/packages/trunk/amphetamine/debian/rules?op=file&rev=0&sc=0
http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/pkg-games/packages/trunk/amphetamine/debian/control?op=file&rev=0&sc=0
http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/pkg-games/packages/trunk/amphetamine/debian/postinst?op=file&rev=0&sc=0

http://sources.gentoo.org/viewcvs.py/gentoo-x86/games-arcade/holotz-castle/holotz-castle-1.3.8.ebuild?rev=1.3&view=markup
http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/pkg-games/packages/trunk/holotz-castle/debian/rules?op=file&rev=0&sc=0
http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/pkg-games/packages/trunk/holotz-castle/debian/control?op=file&rev=0&sc=0


http://sources.gentoo.org/viewcvs.py/gentoo-x86/games-arcade/late/late-0.1.0.ebuild?rev=1.10&view=markup
http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/pkg-games/packages/trunk/late/debian/rules?op=file&rev=0&sc=0
http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/pkg-games/packages/trunk/late/debian/postinst?op=file&rev=0&sc=0
http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/pkg-games/packages/trunk/late/debian/postrm?op=file&rev=0&sc=0


http://sources.gentoo.org/viewcvs.py/gentoo-x86/games-arcade/ppracer/ppracer-0.3.1.ebuild?rev=1.15&view=markup
http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/pkg-games/packages/trunk/ppracer/debian/rules?op=file&rev=0&sc=0


One more thing, the ebuilds mostly need not be updated when an upstream release occurs, they just need to be copied and given a different filename.

13 March 2007

Evan Prodromou: 22 Vent se CCXV

Big night last night at South by Southwest. I went to the Yahoo! party, which was packed and had an open bar with call drinks. I drank Bombay Sapphire with tonic and picked up a pipes.yahoo.com and a upcoming.org T-shirt. Clean T-shirts are the best thing to have at the end of a long conference. Then the "South by Northwest" party, for Canadians and those who love them, and the Creative Commons party across the street. I got to hang out with my friend Nicolas Ritoux and Armand Geddyn, which was a pretty potent recipe for staying out late and acting weird. It was a little hard to get to the conference this morning at 10AM, but I was a little relieved that my dozens of tipsy twitter messages didn't actually get broadcast for some reason. There was some funny material in there, but I also lost my ability to spell after the third party. tags:

Martin Michlmayr: Quality Improvement in Free Software: Release Management

As I'm nearing the completion of my PhD, I'm starting to write about the findings from my research. The aim of my PhD is to investigate quality improvement in free software projects. After some exploratory studies about quality in free software, I decided to focus on release management as one problematic area in which improvement is possible. My approach is to study the development process of projects and to investigate ways how these processes can be improved. The hope is that such improvements will lead to increased levels of quality in the software produced by free software projects. With regard to release management, I'm focusing especially on large and complex projects, in which hundreds of volunteers need to be coordinated during release preparations. I've been looking particularly at time based release management since my exploratory studies have shown that there is significant interest in this release management strategy. The main question of my research is how and why time based release management works for large free software projects. In my first series of postings, I will introduce the seven free software projects I have studied in depth during my research. For each project, I will briefly summarize what problems the project faced in the past, what changes they have implemented to address these problems, and what outstanding problems they still have.

Wouter Verhelst: Iniscripts

Been trying out upstart today. It's a nice piece of code, but unfortunately it's totally useless today. Not because its concepts suck; rather, because Debian packages today ship with SysV-style initscripts, and those do not integrate well with upstart: most of the features that make upstart so interesting require you to create an event.d script, which has a totally different syntax. The Debian Developer inside me couldn't help but start to think about a way to fix this, but that seems harder than what it initially would sound like to the uninitiated. My first idea was to add some /sbin executable to upstart or one of its supporting packages, so that a SysV-style initscript could exit if that binary told it that upstart was running, before doing anything. That way, a package could ship both upstart event.d files and SysV-style initscripts during a migration period, and we could get rid of the SysV-style initscripts when and if Debian eventually decides to migrate to upstar. But when I sent that past #debian-devel, someone mentioned initng, which is yet a different init implementation. If this would work for upstart, it could also work for initng, and I don't think many packages would want to ship initscripts for three different init implementations. So scratch that. My next idea was to generate initscripts, rather than have packages ship them. The amount of common code in our initscripts is huge, anyway, and it's not as if it's all that hard to write an initscript. The things an initscript needs to do are limited, anyway: start a daemon when requested, stop it, restart it, perhaps send it a SIGHUP if or when configuration updates have been performed, and provide some useful output on all that. In most cases, that's about it. So, I thought, why not create an RFC822-style file (analogously to other files in the debian/ directory of a debian source package) containing all the metadata on an initscript, and generate the correct style of initscript out of that? That should work, I thought. So I started writing a specification, and had a look at the initscript of one of my own packages, nbd-server. Which does this at some point (nonrelevant content cut out):
i=0
while [ ! -z $ NBD_FILE[$i]  ]
do
  start-stop-daemon --start --quiet --exec /bin/nbd-server (...)
  echo -n " $ NBD_FILE[$i]  ]
  i=$(( $i + 1 ))
done
There's no way you'll be able to express that type of flexibility with an RFC822-style file containing all the metadata. So, scratch that too. I still do think generating initscripts is the right thing to do, however; the question that remains is "how". One idea I had was to use m4 in an autoconf kind of way, since autoconf allows one to mix autoconf macros with "regular" shell snippets, which would be exactly the kind of flexibility that one would need. However, that totally ignores the fact that autoconf is only able to pull this off because its output is shellscript in every case. An m4 macro that has to produce output which are not, in fact, shellscripts (such as would be the case for this project) could not do that. I think I'm kinda stuck now...

Julien Danjou: DeFuBu contest #8

Bug Welcome to this 8th issue of the DeFuBu contest, the almost monthly championship of the funniest bug reported to the Debian BTS. The challengers How the vote has been done Four Debian related people voted, Raphael Hertzog, Jeroen van Wolffelaar, Ana Guerrero and Margarita Manterola. Full ranking Bugs Challengers The winners Notes To participate, simply drop me an email with a bug number or a request to vote, or anything that may help. About DeFuBu

Meike Reichle: More on pneumatics

Maks: You're welcome! This is not actually my current playlist or top 10 (or top 11) though. It's really just the songs that put most strain on said pneumatic thingy by having a rhythm that is on the one hand catchy enough to make me bounce along and on the other hand slow enough to be "doinged" with an office chair. (NOFX's Don't call me white is a good example for a totally undoingable song. The classic punk rhythm generally is just way too fast to be rendered on an office chair without stopping to type. Thinking about it, I guess Ska sucks by Propaghandi roughly marks the line between doingability and undoingability) The word creations in this post are especially dedicated to Clint. A surreal salute!

12 March 2007

Gunnar Wolf: Alive again

Due to the extreme stupidity of the bank that holds my money whenever I have some, we were unable to pay my main domain name (gwolf.org) together with two others - I mean, the fscking bank mixed up the secret questions/answers, and we were unable to confirm our identity in order to pay to my favorite registrar (do you know they sponsor Debconf? I've been their customer for at least five years, and they rock).
As of this Sunday, gwolf.org went off the net. Of course, being it a sunday, it was impossible to get a human in the right area of the bank.
I must really thank Nadezhda: Despite being quite busy today, and after spending a couple of frustrating hours Sunday night trying to reach somebody, she managed to take the needed steps. Our domains are back to life.
If you sent me a mail during this weekend, please send it again.

Erich Schubert: What made Debian cool

Debian used to be the cool kid among Linux distributions. Because our stuff worked much better, was easy to install and especially to upgrade. Dependencies would be automatically resolved while others were fighting dependency chaos, and our menus would have all the apps in it, where others had to fill their menus on their own. And at the same time, Debian was very flexible and could be customized to become e.g. Knoppix. Our bugtracking was great and we were openly discussing bugs and all this stuff. Many of these Debian achievements are now common among distributions. Especially among Debian-derived distributions. Debian however has become a reliable 'stable' distribution often even called 'stale', while others stand in the spotlight of innovation. Other distributions have come up with maybe more advanced bugtrackers (I'm not talking bugzilla, which IMHO is overengineered) and other tools. Technically, this isn't completely true. There are still many fields where Debian is technically leading. But our focus has recently been a lot about individual packages or components (e.g. the installer). Maybe we should try focusing more on infrastructure again. In fact, Debian still has some very good infrastructure components others might be lacking. Our QA tools (including bug counters, tracking which versions are affected by which bugs, all kinds of graphs, wotomae) are great. All our update-* commands are missing in many other distributions, also things like invoke-rc.d. We have a solid Python policy to support multiple Python versions and precompilation (judging from the SELinux policy, none of the other distributions has that yet). We're able to use dash as a minimal shell instead of bash in most places (which does make a speed and memory difference). We have Debtags. But these projects don't play a key role in Debian anymore AFAICT. Trying to start a major infrastructure thing requires a LOT of engagement, maybe too much. I'd love to see better SELinux support in Debian, but I can't do it on my own, it's just too much. And I find it very hard to find people to help me with that effort. If Enrico hadn't been pushing Debtags again and again (and with a lot of code), it would also have gone stale. Despite being IMHO something that can take Debian on top again (making it a lot easier to find appropriate software). One of the reasons why Debian is still living pretty much outside is that it would be a huge effort to get maintainers to add the corresponding Tag information to their packages and so on. I've always balked at even trying that, fortunately Enrico got some tag information added via overrides to the Packages file already. Another thing that should have been happening within Debian (but happened at Ubuntu) is 'upstart'. There have been a couple of packages dealing with new init systems, but none ever managed to get support into other packages (nor is there any package in Debian with upstart support that I'm aware of). Getting SELinux strict support into init ramdisks is another big thing I'm too scared of to even attempt... i.e. I doubt that I'll be able to do that on my own, yet even to get it into the actual packages... DPL candidates: any ideas on how to be come more agile in such points (e.g. adding support to sysvinit+upstart+initng+runit to all packages with init scripts)? It took us already ages to get LSB headers added to many init scripts. Or on any of the other transitions we should do (SELinux support, Debtags, ...), or even why we've lost this flexibility? The one idea I have for that is to try to do some hackfests. Like an init transition day, where a group of people tries to NMU most of the packages that have init scripts. Or adds "Homepage:" to most packages, which some important package metadata we only have on some packages. Or adding 'watch' files. Some of these would be easier if we had a common way of packaging and a central SVN repository. That would make it both easier to prepare the transition (e.g. committing init scripts beforehand) or especially for adding Homepage metadata and watch files without actually interfering with the maintainers work by not doing an upload immedeately, but just adding them to SVN so the maintainer includes them on his next upload. (Sorry, no comments enabled in my blog.) P.S. another thing I'd really love to see is a (semantic) PackageWiki for Debian, that has a Wiki-like structure with a page for each (Source-) package. Including things like e.g. Screenshots, Homepage link, Link to the Freshmeat page of the package, support lists/groups ... Kind of like the QA pages, but for the actual users, and editable by visitors.

Erich Schubert: Debian wish for lenny

I have a Debian wish for lenny: Why do we really have to make a distinction between NMUs and maintainer uploads? I agree that we need to have someone (which can be a group) be responsible for packages and need to keep track of that to detect unmaintained packages (as well as to have someone track bug reports). With this central repository, we could have NMUs committed to the packages directly, and make contribution easier in general. For example, right now transations are usually added to a package via a bug report. The maintainer then needs to go through these bug reports (and some packages have so many open bugs I doubt the maintainer has a real overview over them; so he might easily miss some easy to fix ones), extract the patch and apply it to his package after review. With this central patch tracking system, the translators could just commit the translation change to the package directly, and it will end up in the next upload automatically. (Note that I'm not trying to force all packages to be maintained this way. I agree that for some packages it's not really appropriate. In general it should be left to the maintainers discretion. However I guess many team-maintained packages are handled in a similar way already, and I'd like to use that for my packages as well, even when not having Co-Maintainers. I'm also aware that when fixing security issues, you might not want to make your changes world visible immediately. This can however be done using SVK if we end up using SVN, for example.) Some rationale for this suggestion: In fact I think that other distributions (e.g. *BSD ports, Gentoo?) are ahead of us in this respect, having a standard way of packaging and building things and keeping track of changes. Anyway, just my € 0.02 [Yes, I'm aware that this was covered in the DPL debate, but IMHO the point of different packaging preferences falls a bit short, and probably needs to be addressed first, before being able to have a central VCS for all packages. Also I think we should be able to find a common VCS we can all live with, or at least 90% of packages.] [And yes, I'm aware that this is a controversial topic that can easily start yet another flameware. But we need to find a way of keeping flamewars down anyway...]

Erich Schubert: Swingin' M nchen

München (Munich!) has a great swing scene - alive and kicking. Lindy Hop [wikipedia], Balboa [wikipedia], Boogie Woogie [wikipedia] (~ East Coast Swing) and Rock'n'Roll [wikipedia] (the acrobatic version) all over the place. Since starting dancing (RnR some years ago, Lindy a year ago, all just socially until about half a year where I took on the others as well and started going to some real trainings), they've become an essential part of my life that I wouldn't want to miss. If you happen to come to Munich, here are some links for you: P.S. My personal favourites / recommendations: Go to Cord or Salon Erna to see how much fun the community is, then take classes with Swing and the City or Keep on Swinging.

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